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Disgrifiad

Sefydlodd Catrawd Rhif 24, Cyffinwyr De Cymru, eu pencadlys catrodol yn Aberhonddu ym 1873 a chysegrwyd Capel Havard yng Nghadeirlan Aberhonddu fel y Capel Catrodol ym 1922. Ym 1934, cyflwynwyd y Baneri enwog a gariwyd gan y Gatrawd yn ystod Rhyfel Zwlw 1879 i'r Capel. Achubwyd Baner y Frenhines Rhif 1/24 gan yr Is-gapteiniaid Melvill a Coghill wedi'r trychineb yn Isandhlwana. Anrhydeddwyd y ddau, a laddwyd gan y Zwlŵaid, gyda'r Groes Victoria wedi'u marwolaethau. Rhoddwyd y baneri arbennig hyn mewn casys yn 2002, oherwydd eu pwysigrwydd ac er mwyn eu gwarchod rhag dirywio ymhellach.

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Sylwadau (3)

Anonymous's profile picture
In 1879 the 24th foot was called the 2nd Warwickshire regiment, the swb did not exist. The men who fought and died at Isandlwana and at Rorkes Drift, fought under the name of the 2nd Warwickshire regiment, not the swb. The regiment was originally founded for the defence of the English Kingdom, and therefor is an English regiment, not welsh. Of the 123 men of the 24th foot 2nd Warwickshire regiment that fought at Rorkes Drift, only 14 were welsh, yet the welsh claim this honour for themselves. The regiment now finds itself lost in wales due to the reforms of 1881, and the welsh now bask in the glory that was won by the Warwickshires. The 24th should never be part of the royal welsh, they are an English regiment (as defined in their raising), they should be repatriated back to their home of Warwickshire England, and given back the credit, honour and glory for the battle of Rorkes Drift, and stop the welsh gloating on a myth created by a film called 'zulu', but which was something that they played very little part in.
Casglu'r Tlysau's profile picture
Response from South Wales Borderers Museum: The user is of course correct in what he/she has said - to an extent. There are clearly many errors in the film "Zulu", for example, where the Regiment is identified as the SWB. It would have been nice if they had gotten all the facts right in the film. However, the film was not produced as a documentary. And of course, the Regiment and Museum had no say in its content. In 1881 the 2nd Warwickshire Regiment (24th Regt of Foot) changed its name to the South Wales Borderers to reflect the position of its Regimental Depot in Brecon (where it had been based since 1872/3), but still remained the 24th Regiment of Foot . So, same Regiment - different name ! Many other Regiments also changed their names at this time based on their geographical locations. How many Welshmen were there in the Regiment at this time ? It's impossible to say, the data is quite inconclusive. You initially need to define the term "Welshmen". Is it someone who was born in Wales; or lives in Wales, or speaks Welsh, or who has a Welsh father: etc, etc . All we can say with certainty is that the 24th (and 23rd and 41st) Regiments, being based in Wales, all contained a higher proportion of Welshmen than the other regiments. The 25th Brigade based in Brecon (which included the 24th Regiment) recruited (in theory) from four local counties.The regiment was relocated to Brecon in 1872/3 to take advantage of the recruiting possibilities offered by ther highly industrialised area along the heads of the South Wales valleys. Most recruits at this time were unskilled industrial labourers (as opposed to the previous century when unskilled agricultural labourers provided the bulk of recruits). In simple mathematical terms, if the battalion of 850 men was composed of 12 year men, then it would need (on average) to find 70 recruits per year, multiply this by 6 (the number of years at Brecon) and by 2 (the number of battalions) you get something likethe number who OUGHT to have been Welsh (some 50%). If the battalions were composed wholly of 6 year men, then the percentage OUGHT to have been 100%. However, a person's name, where he was from, and where he enlisted give no real sound indication of a nationality. You can not assume that the name Williams, Evans or Jones equated to being Welsh, or the fact that he was from Merthyr Tydfil. There were also a lot of Irishmen who were working in the coalfields, and in the iron and steel works in this area!! There is therefore no way that anyone can say conclusively that of the defenders at Rorkes Drift "only 14 were Welsh". We will never know for certain the exact number. Within the Anglo-Zulu War room in our Museum we do not state that the Regiment was either Welsh or English ! There were strictly NO Welsh regiments or English regiments - the regiments were of course regiments of the British army. And of course an Act of Union had previously UNITED Wales and England ! Interestingly, we have been looking at the Welsh language press in Wales at this period - there were well over 200 newspapers printed in Welsh. Many of these do describe the 24th as "our Regiment" so there was clearly, even at this stage, a growing sense of identity with Wales. This has obviously continued to develop and strengthen over the years, through the various titles of the Regiment - The South Wales Borderers, the Royal Regiment of Wales and currently The Royal Welsh.
Anonymous's profile picture
The description below the photograph starts off by saying; The 24th Regiment - South Wales Borderers - ???? This statement is totally wrong, The 24th regiment was NEVER called the SWB. The reason being that in July 1881, regimental numbers were ordered to be discontinued, and also new names were ordered for the regiments, therefor, the last infantry regiment to have the numbers 24th in their title were the 24th foot (2nd Warwickshire) regiment. After the numbers were ordered to be discontinued, and also the regiments name ordered to be changed, the 24th foot (2nd Warwickshire) regiment became just the SWB, with no numbers, so any reference to the 24th foot/regiment is not the SWB. The 24th (2nd Warwickshire) regiment, did not move its depot to Brecon in 1873 of its own accord, it was forced to move by the then government, who (for some unknown reason, and in my opinion), wrongly placed the regiment into the borders of south Wales, whilst at the same time, wrongly (again in my opinion), moved an already established regiment from the south Wales border (the 43rd Monmouthshire regiment) into the English county of Oxfordshire, this makes no sense. The caption says 'The regimental colours of the SWB in Brecon cathedral', if this caption is refering to the regimental colours used in the Zulu war, then I would suggest that visitors take a look at the name of the regiment that is in the centre of the regimental colours, they will see that it says the 2nd Warwickshire regiment, and NOT the SWB. I have been doing some checking about the so called 'facts, figures and stats' used in the reply, and found that although the 24th (2nd Warwickshire) regiment had its depot moved to Brecon in 1873, neither battalion had been to Brecon at the start of the Zulu war, and that of the 123 men of the 24th (2nd Warwickshire) regiment that fought at Rorke's Drift, only 15 of them were Welsh. If the Anglo-Zulu war room at the museum at Brecon is supposed to be dedicated to the memory of this regiment, then there should be lots of references to the name of the regiment when it fought in that war, yet, from what I hear, there is hardly any reference to the 2nd Warwickshire regiment, and if the websites are anything to go by, then I suppose that the real name of the regiment is conveniently excluded by just saying the 24th foot/regiment, again, this is totally wrong, as this implies the regiment between the years 1751 and 1782, after 1782 and until July 1881, the regiment was the 24th foot (2nd Warwickshire) regiment, and this is the name that should be in large letters for the public to see, and used at all times when refering to the regiment during the Zulu war. It is a shame that exhibitions, museums and other places including websites, that are supposedly dedicated to this regiment, tend to exclude the real name of it. The name that these places should be proud to show is The 24th foot (2nd Warwickshire) regiment, so why do they tend to exclude it, could it be that because it's name is an English name, they are scared that people will see through the cover up and the myth that the regiment was Welsh? If these sort of places are supposed to be deicated to this regiment, then at least display its name to the public, and in large letters. And just in case you have forgotten what that name is by hiding it behind the mask of the SWB, then I will tell you. Its name is, The 24th foot (2nd Warwickshire) regiment. Don't hide it behind the Welsh mask, display it proudly, even though it is English.

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